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al3
Titel: Can't mount or boot sda1 (WinXP). Help.  BeitragVerfasst am: 10.07.2006, 18:58 Uhr



Anmeldung: 13. Mai 2005
Beiträge: 446

Here is the set-up... and I know it's strange but it works.... 'cept for
WindowsXP.

I have 2 SATA 60 (maybe 80?) GB HDs.

sda1=WinXP
sda2=Kanotix

sdb1=empty
sdb2=swap
sdb3=Etch
sdb4=Kubuntu

mbr= boot to sdb3 (Etch)
From etch I select Kanotix on sda2.

I used to only run Linux on sdB and Win on sdA. But about 8 months ago I
used Qtparted (mistake!) to shrink sda1 (Win) down by 15 GB and created
sda2 and installed Kanotix. I use it every day, works fine. Great. No
problems.

However I find that I can't mount (or boot) to sda1 (Windows). Was never
a problem as I never used XP... but now I have a program I need to run.

When I boot and select XP from grub's menu.lst I go from the blue/white
menu screen on Etch to a black/white menu... on where?... without a
choice for XP on it. Looks like there is a grub on boot sector of sda1?
Where did that come from? But that's not the main problem. I can't
mount the sda1 partition.

Below is some info.

dmesg:

NTFS-fs error (device sda1): ntfs_fill_super(): Not an NTFS volume.
NTFS-fs warning (device sda1): is_boot_sector_ntfs(): Invalid boot
sector checksum.
NTFS-fs error (device sda1): read_ntfs_boot_sector(): Primary boot
sector is invalid.
NTFS-fs error (device sda1): read_ntfs_boot_sector(): Mount option
errors=recover not used. Aborting without trying to recover.




> ~$ cat /etc/fstab
>

al@kanotix1:~$ cat /etc/fstab
# /etc/fstab: static file system information.
#
# <file system> <mount point> <type> <options> <dump> <pass>
proc /proc proc defaults 0 0
usbfs /proc/bus/usb usbfs devmode=0666 0 0
/dev/sda2 / reiserfs defaults 0 1
#/dev/sda1 /media/sda1 ntfs ro,umask=000 0 0
/dev/sda1 /media/sda1 ntfs noauto,users,exec,ro,umask=000 0 0
/dev/sdb3 /media/sdb3 reiserfs noauto,users,exec 0 0
/dev/sdb4 /media/sdb4 reiserfs noauto,users,exec 0 0
/dev/sdb1 /media/sdb1 reiserfs noauto,users,exec 0 0
/dev/sdb2 none swap defaults 0 0
#/dev/cdrom /media/cdrom0 udf,iso9660 users,noauto 0 0
/dev/hdc /media/cdrom0 udf,iso9660 users,noauto 0 0
/dev/fd0 /media/floppy0 auto rw,user,noauto 0 0
#none /sys sysfs defaults 0 0
sysfs /sys sysfs defaults 0 0
tmpfs /dev/shm tmpfs defaults 0 0




> ~$ cat /etc/mtab
>
al@kanotix1:~$ cat /etc/mtab
/dev/sda2 / reiserfs rw 0 0
proc /proc proc rw 0 0
sysfs /sys sysfs rw 0 0
usbfs /proc/bus/usb usbfs rw,devmode=0666 0 0
tmpfs /dev/shm tmpfs rw 0 0
devpts /dev/pts devpts rw,gid=5,mode=620 0 0
tmpfs /dev tmpfs rw,size=10M,mode=0755 0 0





> ~$ mount
>



root@kanotix1:/home/al# mount
/dev/sda2 on / type reiserfs (rw)
proc on /proc type proc (rw)
sysfs on /sys type sysfs (rw)
usbfs on /proc/bus/usb type usbfs (rw,devmode=0666)
tmpfs on /dev/shm type tmpfs (rw)
devpts on /dev/pts type devpts (rw,gid=5,mode=620)
tmpfs on /dev type tmpfs (rw,size=10M,mode=0755)




> ~$ sudo fdisk -l /dev/sda
> (might as well post the info from fdisk for each/all your HDDs )
>

root@kanotix1:/home/al# fdisk -l /dev/sda

Disk /dev/sda: 80.0 GB, 80026361856 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 9729 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/sda1 * 1 5264 42282268 7 HPFS/NTFS
Partition 1 does not end on cylinder boundary.
/dev/sda2 5265 6830 12578895 83 Linux


NOTICE ABOVE 'WARNING' ABOUT NOT ENDING ON A CYL BOUNDRY.


I'm getting all sorts of conflicting advice from various sources. Some
people say to run 'fixboot' from WinXP install disk. So how does fixing
the boot sector of sda1 (not mbr) have anything to do with mounting?

Another says to run XP 'chkdsk'. But that could make changes to sda2 (my
kanotix partition) right? Can't do that right now.

Another says to try ntfsfix but I'm not sure WHAT that will do, if
anything.

Another says that the hard disk is borked and that sooner or later my
sda2 partition will crap out because of the boundary thing...
especially if I reboot often. But I've been running it for 8 months
now! And how would rebooting change anything or cause sda1 to overlap
into sda2?

Another said to try the gparted livecd and resize the sda1 partition
again. But what damage might that do to sda2, if any?

Obviously one answer is for me to wait until the new release of Kanotix
comes out (very soon now) and install it to my empty partition on sdB1
and then hose sda and repartition it for 50 GB for Windows and then
install Windows and then go back and fix the mbr (which XP will
clobber.) Obviously a major time-sink... and PITA.

However, if there is an easy way to fix this one damn Windows partition
so I can boot (and mount) the damn thing just to run this one frickin'
program, that's where I want to go today if I can.

Anyone here have any idea. The 'help' I've gotten from the net... is
just confusing and conflicting.

Thanks,

Al

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al3
Titel: RE: Can  BeitragVerfasst am: 10.07.2006, 20:26 Uhr



Anmeldung: 13. Mai 2005
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http://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-d ... 00908.html

Could this be the answer? Anyone know?

-Al

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h2
Titel: RE: Can  BeitragVerfasst am: 10.07.2006, 20:50 Uhr



Anmeldung: 12. Mar 2005
Beiträge: 1005

I assume qtparted destroyed the ntfs partition's integrity when you resized it. It sounds like you never booted into xp until you discovered just now that it doesn't work, is that right?

You can't safely resize ntfs with the parted tools, that's very risky, I'd never do that. You have to use commercial software to do that safely, partition magic will do it for you fairly safely, if run from within xp, kano likes another one, can't remember its name, also commercial.

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al3
Titel: Re: RE: Can  BeitragVerfasst am: 10.07.2006, 21:07 Uhr



Anmeldung: 13. Mai 2005
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h2 hat folgendes geschrieben::
I assume qtparted destroyed the ntfs partition's integrity when you resized it. It sounds like you never booted into xp until you discovered just now that it doesn't work, is that right?


Yes, that's right.

Zitat:

You can't safely resize ntfs with the parted tools, that's very risky, I'd never do that. You have to use commercial software to do that safely, partition magic will do it for you fairly safely, if run from within xp, kano likes another one, can't remember its name, also commercial.


Well, if you or anyone has an idea of how to save this partitiion, do let me know.

Thanks,

Al

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h2
Titel: RE: Re: RE: Can  BeitragVerfasst am: 10.07.2006, 21:28 Uhr



Anmeldung: 12. Mar 2005
Beiträge: 1005

It's a safe bet it's totally destroyed.

You can try booting into the livecd and see if you can mount the partition. You can try installing windows on another partition and seeing if you can mount the partition.

But after that, unless someone out there has a workable solution, I'd guess that your partition is totally destroyed.

That's what happened to me last time I tried resizing a partition, and that was an ext3, and expanding it.

The resize partition option shouldn't be available in qtparted for ntfs, that's just not cool, it doesn't work, and it shouldn't pretend that it does, how is the user supposed to know that it doesn't when it looks like it does?

the ext3 and reiserfs stuff is bad enough, but forget about working on ntfs with open source stuff for now. Safest is always to delete partition after copying the data, which you can't really do with ntfs anyway if you need to write back to it to restore, then create new size partitions, reformat to filesystem. That works pretty well.

PS: I have used gparted to resize ntfs however, and it worked, so it's hard to say this stuff for sure. That's how I got kanotix on a laptop, and gparted worked fine, no issues at all. NOTE: that's Gparted live cd, not QTparted. Qtparted should go away and take a vacaction or something.
 
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al3
Titel:   BeitragVerfasst am: 10.07.2006, 21:38 Uhr



Anmeldung: 13. Mai 2005
Beiträge: 446

Zitat:

The resize partition option shouldn't be available in qtparted for ntfs, that's just not cool, it doesn't work, and it shouldn't pretend that it does, how is the user supposed to know that it doesn't when it looks like it does?

the ext3 and reiserfs stuff is bad enough, but forget about working on ntfs with open source stuff for now. Safest is always to delete partition after copying the data, which you can't really do with ntfs anyway if you need to write back to it to restore, then create new size partitions, reformat to filesystem. That works pretty well.


Hmmm. How do Linux installers shrink down XP on a hard disk to make room for the Linux partition? You would think that this technology is 'old hat' by now.

If the Windows partition is destroyed, no big deal. I had no data there anyway... but I just want to run XP for one program. (Maybe I'll try wine... probably a waste of time.)

Hmm. Could I destroy the Windows partition sda1, re-create it, and then install Windows and it won't mess with sda2? Yeah, I'll have to reinstall grub to the mbr, but that's easy to do from the live CD.

Again, how do installers shrink Windows?

Al

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h2
Titel:   BeitragVerfasst am: 10.07.2006, 21:41 Uhr



Anmeldung: 12. Mar 2005
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Speaking only for myself, I never install any os on the entire hard disk, I always partition, that's not unique to linux at all.

A lot of people I suspect use things like partition magic. gparted will probably work, if you use the livecd, but there are NEVER any guarantees when you resize partitions that contain an os or data. Partition magic I rarely had any issues at all with, I've resized windows with that many times, it's very clever, and fixes anything in windows as it resizes that needs fixing.

And of course, many people don't run windows at all in the first place, so the question never comes up.
 
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al3
Titel:   BeitragVerfasst am: 10.07.2006, 22:18 Uhr



Anmeldung: 13. Mai 2005
Beiträge: 446

h2 hat folgendes geschrieben::
Speaking only for myself, I never install any os on the entire hard disk, I always partition, that's not unique to linux at all.
.


Is WindowsXP 'smart' enough to install ONLY to a partition I set for it? I didn't know you could partition a HD and then install Windows. I thought it ALWAYS takes up the whole HD.

Live and learn. (I've not run Win in 3 years).

So basically you think that because I shrunk Windows down that I hosed the partition and that's why it won't mount or boot?

Al

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h2
Titel:   BeitragVerfasst am: 11.07.2006, 00:46 Uhr



Anmeldung: 12. Mar 2005
Beiträge: 1005

When you install windows you are presented with a very crude partition manager, that allows you to chop up your drive into as many partitions as you want, but it only allows you to format the one you are installing onto.

That's always by far and away the easiest way to partition given the case of installing windows first.

That's when I usually do the basic partitioning. I try to keep partition magic off my systems as much as possible, despite what I said, they have had issues in the past, with bugs that would not allow any system to partition it after it without a headache. I actually resolved some of those using one particular, early version, of gparted livecd. A later one couldn't handle it.

If you accept the defaults of the window install it will take up your whole hard drive, but then again, if you accept the defaults for almost any software install you will end up filling your machine with spyware and pseudospyware every time you install more software. Or junk software that should never be touched. As a general rule, all windows default tend to be bad, so the easiest way to get around that in windows is to always avoid the defaults and do it the way you want.

Basically, yes, that's what I think, since I did the same thing myself on a partition, wait, hmmm... no, I remember now, it was in fact ntfs on that one, I think anyway. like I said, gparted livecd has successfully resized partitions containing windows, but it's a very high risk activity, and you should expect full data loss, then be pleasantly surprised if it actually worked.

Your data can be recovered using various tools out there, since probably the only thing that got corrupted was the partition table, or mabye not. After that it's all guesses, so I'll refrain from guessing.

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al3
Titel:   BeitragVerfasst am: 13.07.2006, 04:15 Uhr



Anmeldung: 13. Mai 2005
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I wonder. Do you think that if I boot up the new gparted live-CD and resize the sda1 Windows partition just a bit that maybe the end-boundry thing might be corrected and the damn thing will at least mount? Maybe it's just that simple?

About a year ago I used the old QTparted to resize (shrink) XP on wife's laptop to carve out some room for Kanotix. Her XP boots fine. Mine doesn't.

I'm just confounded by this. I've gotten so much advice... ntfsfix, chkdisk, fixboot, that I don't know what to do anymore.

Al

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h2
Titel:   BeitragVerfasst am: 13.07.2006, 05:05 Uhr



Anmeldung: 12. Mar 2005
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I'd try all of those, good guesses all. I'd try the fix stuff first, see if that made xp mount or boot, if not, I'd try the gparted livecd resize.

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slam
Titel:   BeitragVerfasst am: 13.07.2006, 08:23 Uhr



Anmeldung: 05. Okt 2004
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Wohnort: w3
1) Boot from XP-CD (or rescue floppy), use rescue mode and run chkdsk on this partition.
2) You might try booting the Gparted Live-CD and resize this NTFS-Partition back to it's original size. This might make it mountable for Windows again, but you really need to recover the exact geometry of the old partition. If it works, do 1).
But please be aware, that every time you boot anything that mounts the partition, you risk to destroy more. And don't forget - restoring a useless Win-Install wihtout data may keep you busy much longer than simply re-partition, format, re-install it.

But probably we can solve the real problem here:
Zitat:
However, if there is an easy way to fix this one damn Windows partition so I can boot (and mount) the damn thing just to run this one frickin' program, that's where I want to go today if I can.

Which f***in' program? Perhaps we can make it run in Kanotix - and you can free yourself forever from the Win-sickness. Winken

Greetings,
Chris

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al3
Titel:   BeitragVerfasst am: 13.07.2006, 21:26 Uhr



Anmeldung: 13. Mai 2005
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slam hat folgendes geschrieben::
1) Boot from XP-CD (or rescue floppy), use rescue mode and run chkdsk on this partition.


But there is the possibility that XP chkdsk will make a change to sda2... which is my Kanotix partition. I don't want that! I would not trust a Windows utility for anything mission critical like this.

Zitat:

2) You might try booting the Gparted Live-CD and resize this NTFS-Partition back to it's original size. This might make it mountable for Windows again, but you really need to recover the exact geometry of the old partition. If it works, do 1)


Well the original sda1 (WinXP) partition was the size of the whole damn HD. I had to shrink it down to make room for Kanotix.

Zitat:

.
But please be aware, that every time you boot anything that mounts the partition, you risk to destroy more.


Well, fortunately Kanotix does not try to mount other partitions (not sure why!) And since it can't be mounted anyway what damage can occur? I've had the bad partition for who knows how long. Of course, I only boot once a month if that. But I don't see how having a bad sda1 can or will somehow cause a bad sda2. Linux is better than that!!

Zitat:


And don't forget - restoring a useless Win-Install wihtout data may keep you busy much longer than simply re-partition, format, re-install it.


So the drill would be to install XP again. Easy for you to say as I've never installed XP (only Linux.. about a 1000 times). Is XP smart enough not to clober my sda2? I assume I should delete the sda1, re-create it and format it to ntfs? Is this done with cfdisk or gparted. (I've used cfdisk before... a bit clunky but it works.) Sorry to sound so dumb here but I do know Linux but I've not used Win for about 3 or 4 years now. Our business and our home is Linux based. Wife is writer and uses OO and KDE solitaire! My biz uses Jaya123 (www.jaya123.com) and OO, and MySQL with phpMyAdmin, and the KDE suite of utilities for IM, PIM, and other stuff. We just don't need XP... but keep it on our HDs just in case one day we will.

Zitat:


Which f***in' program? Perhaps we can make it run in Kanotix - and you can free yourself forever from the Win-sickness. Winken


I don't have the program yet. It's for a class I want to take...has a sample exam... questions and answers... probably programmed in C. They say it runs on XP and Mac so maybe it is browser based? That would be good. I would have to contact the company and find out... probably a good idea.

Thanks,

Al

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stryder
Titel:   BeitragVerfasst am: 14.07.2006, 04:29 Uhr



Anmeldung: 26. Jun 2005
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Al, no one can guarantee that nothing will go wrong when you mess around with partitions. If you are concerned about your kanotix partition, back it up in your second hard drive. Disconnect the second hard drive if you want to be absolutely sure. Worrying about possibilities will not solve your problems.

As h2 pointed out, windows can be installed to a partition. You need to identify the partition correctly, probably from the size of the partition. When windows install it will reformat the partition.

Better still, you should delete everything, make 2 new partitions when installing, install windows, boot into a livecd, reformat the second partition and restore your kanotix OS. Then do the grub/MBR thing to point to your etch in sdb3 and things should be back as before.
 
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